Another Straw for the Camels Back or More Hamster Chow

[BornToStripe]

Actually to quote Elvis Costello " I used to be amazed, but now I'm merely amused"

Oh wow, you are showing your age...and like Ken, in need of immediate Axona treatment.  Elvis the C, lesser half of the inimitable Diana Krall, actually sang "Oh I used to be disgusted and now I try to be amused".  All the resources of your incredible brain (and the internet) and yet you can't get the words right to 'Red Shoes', one of E's best songs*? Epic Quote Fail?  What? Is that like a Quote Lie? I mean you HAD THE INFO AT YOUR FINGERTIPS AND YOU MISSPOKE, so to speak. And I musta missed Ken's Pelosi quote entirely.  No biggy. I understand you old guys sometimes get confused.

I like your argument on the spending habits of the two "regimes", altho one did inherit a pretty vibrant economy and the other inherited a economy crippled in one leg and not too good on the other.  One spent a lot of money waging war on a militarily impotent country far far away and the other spent a lot of money waging war on a failing economy here at home.  I can see why you think the latter is a poor use of government funds.

OK, just so we can move on, Obama was stupid for trusting the 'product' produced by government bureaucrats left behind by his predecessor**.  He lied thru his teeth, if your idea of a lie is making a promise based on the best available statistics the government can supply. (Should we go through a long dialog about presidential promises made and broken in the 21st century? and lies too?) Asked and answered.  I understand that you are fixated on that one statement, and it has constipated your argument.  In your mind, you are no doubt correct that he should have moved very slowly to do anything about the failing economy.  Maybe you would have been happier if he had done nothing. Maybe he should have fiddled while we burned.  Anything but take action.  Actually you are right, he should have just taken four years of vacation and then let the Republicans take up where they left off.  They were on a roll.  I guess in the fiscally secure state of California, it might have been hard to see that the rest of the U.S. economy was in trouble and that some kind of intervention was necessary.  I can see that.  15% unemployment would have been a small price to pay to make sure the statistics were exact and correct to the decimal point.  Precision is important when the house is on fire.

So, did you and Ken share a room for the Beckapalooza?  I heard they had Sarah Palin blowup dolls for sale.  Weird.

WEEE! Just to see Ken foam at the mouth, I would start a discussion on the Ground Zero Muslim Training Camp*** & Community Center planned for the hallowed ground of the old Burlington Coat Factory in NYC, but first we need to get him started on a campaign to remove the Muslim Training Camp*** that is (HORRORS!) located RIGHT IN THE PENTAGON!  Y'all get right on that willya?  While I'm on that subject, I can't remember if I mentioned this, but Faux News failed to report that one of the largest contributors to the imam of the Ground Zero Muslim Training Camp*** and Community Center...is Faux News' parent company's second largest shareholder.  Imagine that.

Have a nice day.  In fact, have some tea.  Have a tea partay!

Me, I'm going to go suck at Modern Warfare 2 for an hour or two.


*along with, of course, 'Alison' and 'Watching the Detectives'.  Man, the good ol' days of New Wave.  I have a nice pic of me and the GF with Elvis and the Attractions from '78 or '79 if you'd like to feel nostalgic.  He was on Stiff Records at the time...I still have a black promo shirt (well worn, but sadly, too small these days) that says "If it ain't STIFF, it ain't worth a (rhymes with duck)"
** I know you will probably ignore the factual info, but it is what it is.
***Ooops, I meant Mosque.  The smoke from burning Korans got in my eyes whilst I was typing.

[Calif Striper]

    I have had time to ruminate on your reply and drawing on my  present and past careers  I have been attempting to think of all the  measuring devices that I have had at my command that are capable of measuring the  size of our government.
  I have found that micrometers, calipers, tape measures, odometers, ohm meters.  decibel meters, scales and others just could not determine the size of the  government.
  I suppose you could count elected officials and employees but then you have to  consider private contractors and I do not think that would be a true and  accurate representation.
  No I believe that the best way to quantify the size of government is to measure  the amount of money  that it spends to complete its function.
  In case you were unaware government produces no tangible product that can be  readily quantified so it looks like comparing how much money is spent and  assigned to debt is the best measure of size and growth. If you are aware of an  alternative method I'm sure that you will share it with me.
 
  I am not a huge "Dubya" fan (not conservative enough for me). When he  took office the federal obligations were $5.7 trillion. After six years of his  administration these obligations increased by $2.9 trillion. In the two years  that the Dems were controlling the check book these obligations grew by $2  trillion. Obie takes over and increased this debt by $2.8 trillion in a year  and a half. Simply put Bush and the Repubs increased debt at a rate of   $40 billion per month. That is disgusting and unacceptable IMHO. The Dems get  control of Congress and decide to outdo George W's foul habits to the tune of  $80 billion per month or about double. Enter the great spender, he can only  manage to increase the debt for future generations at a rate of $150 billion  per month, or almost four times as fast as that spending fool George Bush  I am not rationalizing Bush, I'm merely  attempting to illustrate how quickly we are jumping from the frying pan right  into the flames.
 
  I also am anticipating the November elections, not because the republicans will  come riding up on their white stallions to save the day, but because hopefully  they can erect a roadblock for the out of control agenda of BHO. As it stands  now The Great One is having trouble getting his wish list fulfilled. The  republicans cannot stop him, maybe there are some Democrats that see the  stupidity of the wild spending spree. The government really does not control  the economy they either hinder or help the people who have the ability to heal  the economy, the free market. Business might stop running scarred with Obie  reeled in and somewhat powerless to drag us down the hole that he has been so  committed to drag us down.
 
 
Let me remind you of the scenario. Barry is in office about  a month and asks Congress to sign off on spending in excess of $800 billion  with a PROMISE that it will cap unemployment at 8%. All Congress has to do is  agree to accept this bill without reading it.   See if  you can follow this. You expect me to understand the complexities of gathering  and analyzing economic data, would it not be fair to expect the same of the man  that morons elected to the most powerful job in the world? How could he make  the PROMISE of capping the unemployment rate if he also were as bright  as are you about  decimating the economic  future? Again I ask, is he not as smart as you, OR DID HE LIE? Those are really  the only reasonable choices. Do you still choose not to answer?
 
Will your ego not allow you to be honest? No I suppose not. To quote \\\STRIPES/// you are just so full of Pelosi it amazes me. Actually to quote Elvis Costello " I used to be amazed, but now I'm merely amused"

[Domingo]

Oh snap, was that supposed to be a burn? Please thank your wife for her concern and curiousity, and she is welcome to stop by and give the equipment both a personal "hands on" inspection and thorough test drive free of charge*.  I guarantee she will find it quite satisfactory.  What happens after that....is your problem.

*I reserve the right to refuse service to the mentally unstable or terminally ugly.

Now let me take a couple more minutes to conflate my reply to your meanderings....

True Obama follower, filled with illusions of grandeur.   

[BornToStripe]

(Quote)"Dubya "Miss Me Yet?" cups, shirts, etc. were always full price.

why?....well as P.T. Barnum was supposed to have said...."There's a sucker born every minute"

[\\\STRIPES///]

(Quote)" I mean you are comparing a guy who left office with an 18% approval rating (where it remains, far behind Obie's 40-47%"

While in DC, I couldn't help but notice how often the Obama souvenirs were on the sale racks.  Dubya "Miss Me Yet?" cups, shirts, etc. were always full price. 

[BornToStripe]

FYI yamon Dubber had more czars than Obie:

Foreign aid czar
AIDS czar (4 of them)
bank bailout czar
bioethics czar
bird flu czar
birth control czar
budget czar (3 of them)
cleanup czar
copyright czar
communications czar
counterterrorism czar
cyber security czar
democracy czar
drug czar (3 of them)
faith-based czar (3 of them)
food safety czar
global AIDS czar (2 of them)
health czar for the World Trade Center
health IT czar
homeland security czar ( 3 of them)
homeless czar
Gulf Coast reconstruction czar
intelligence czar (2 of them)
manufacturing czar (2 of them)
mine safety czar
policy czar
public diplomacy czar ( 2 of them)
reading czar (really?)
regulatory czar (2 of them)
science czar
terrorism czar
war czar
weatherization czar

Thass 33, not including multiples....BUT! there is still time for Obie to czar up. I volunteer for Tuna Tasting Czar.

[BornToStripe]

Just for the heck of it, I researched the National Debt, via the Treasury Department's website.

On January 20, 2009 (the date His Blackness Obie-Wan deposed the BBQ-Crazed "W" aka The Linguistically Challenged One From the Texas Town that is missing its Village Idiot) the debt stood at $10,626,877,048,913.08 ($10.6 trillion for those educated in Texas) and as of last Thursday (9/9/10) it stands at $13,444,496,046,138.49 ($13.4 trillion for those etc.).  That's an increase of $2,817,618,997,225.41 ($2.8 trillion for those etc.) an increase of roughly 25% after approximately 1.5 years of the Dark Lord of the Teleprompter's reign.

It appears, when it comes to math, that Tea Partyers are drinking something stronger than Tea....

Learn some fun facts on your own!:
http://www.treasurydirect.gov/NP/NPGateway

[BornToStripe]

Yes, Ken, we know you still send love letters to W, and you hate the black guy in the white house, but do you REALLY REALLY REALLY want to go there?  I mean you are comparing a guy who left office with an 18% approval rating (where it remains, far behind Obie's 40-47% [YMMV]).  I guess you have forgotten the guy who drove the ship of state far off course and firmly aground on the Shoals of Economic Disaster.  Mr "Good Job, Brownie"?  Mr. WMD?  Mr. TARP? Mr. "Lets give everybody a check for $600 and see if we can buy their vote"?  Must be some of that short term memory loss coming into play...start drinking Axona, now, before its too late.

I know you cut-n-pasted this from some tea party spam mail, replete with errors, so allow me to retort with the same kinda "stuff", only slightly more researched....heck, I will even cut and paste too!

Come on bro, let's play The Dozens....

"Thanks for forwarding this to me. President Obama has made a  few blunders during his first few months in office, but I understand that for a  person who makes as many statements as he does, it is not surprising that he  sometimes stumbles.  I'd rather not  respond to you in a tit for tat manner, but I think it is important to note  that President Bush's 8 years in office were replete with mistakes and bad  policies, all of which plunged our nation deeper into debt, turned allies away  and laid the ground work for one of the most severe financial crises in  history.  That is why Americans  overwhelmingly voted for change.
Conservatives have derided the President of allegedly bowing  to the King of Saudi Arabia.  The White  House says that it was not a bow, but whether it was or was not, how did you  react when George Bush actually KISSED the Saudi King?  Check this out: http://tinyurl.com/pmc98x Were you  upset?  Did you protest?  (AND HE HELD HANDS TOO...!!!!!)

You note that President Obama made a mistake when speaking  Spanish.  It appears that he was making a  joke.  Nevertheless, how did you react  when President Bush addressed Italian Prime Minister Silvio Berlusconi in  Spanish.  You will note that Italians do not  speak Spanish. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=l1O9txBU9FE
http://www.nytimes.com/2008/07/10/science/earth/10notebook.html?ref=world 
President Obama has made a few gaffes but during his 8 years  in office, President Bush misspoke hundreds of times.
Here is a compilation: http://www.slate.com/id/76886/
For example:  "John  Thune has got a common-sense vision for good forest policy. I look forward to  working with him in the United Nations Senate to preserve these national  heritages."
Did you send out emails to your friends every time President  Bush said something silly?
You note that President Obama uses a teleprompter.  I am sure you   know that George Bush used a teleprompter.  Oh yeah, Ronald Reagan also   used a teleprompter.  Check out the links: http://tinyurl.com/mlqz7h and http://tinyurl.com/r43fxj
Your email notes that more people were killed by floods in  the Midwest than died as a result of Hurricane  Katrina.  I looked it up and it just is  not true.  Of the many storms in the Midwest in 2009, the highest death toll thus far is 36 confirmed deaths. http://prod.newsday.com/flash-flood-warning-issued-for-louisville-area-1.1347443
 
  In comparison, there were 1,836 confirmed deaths caused by Hurricane Katrina.
  http://www.dhh.louisiana.gov/offices/page.asp?ID=192&Detail=5248
President Obama inherited an economy in disarray and since  taking office, has aimed to drastically revamp our nation's health care system and  our crumbling infrastructure.  I was curious  to see how the national debt changed during the Bush years and according to  PolitiFact.com, "When Bush took office; the national debt was $5.73 trillion.  When he left, it was $10.7 trillion." http://www.politifact.com/truth-o-meter/statements/2009/jan/22/rahm-emanuel/5-trillion-added-national-debt-under-bush/
Did you know that billions of dollars were wasted during the  Bush administration, particularly in massive contracts given out to private  contractors that operate in Iraq and Afghanistan:  According to one commission set up to  investigate the use of private contractors, "billions of dollars of that amount  ended up wasted due to poorly defined work orders, inadequate oversight and  contractor inefficiencies. In one example, defense auditors challenged KBR  after it billed the government for $100 million in costs for private security  even though the contract prohibited the use of for-hire guards." http://www.usatoday.com/news/military/2009-06-08-report-dod-spending_N.htm 
I hope that we are always critical of those we elect, but I  see that you are not being consistent in your criticism.  Your complaints about President Obama are  ironic, given the fact that President Bush did in fact make so many of the same  mistakes and made them much more often.   Have you heard that expression?  People  who live in glass houses shouldn't throw stones."


I know actually researching tea party spammails can be depressing, but it might keep you from being embarASSED. Let me know if I should....ummm what's that Palinism...."refudiate"....some more of your points.



One final note from me....I haven't heard much from the Wingnut Right about the Defense Intelligence Agency's recent report about the $10 BILLION in CASH (palletized, no less) that disappeared into Iraq in during Bush's "regime" with no accounting....I know, I know, pocket change to someone like you or Cheney, but still, its my tax dollars at work!

[\\\STRIPES///]


If George W. Bush had doubled the national debt, which had taken more than
 two centuries to accumulate, in one year, would you have approved? 



If George W. Bush had then proposed to double the debt again within 10
 years, would you have approved?



If George W. Bush had criticized a state law that he admitted he never even
read would you think that he is just an ignorant hot head?



If George W. Bush joined the country of Mexico and sued a state in the 
United States to force that state to continue to allow illegal immigration,
would you question his patriotism and wonder whose side he was on? 

 
If George W. Bush had put 87000 workers out of work by arbitrarily placing a
moratorium on offshore oil drilling on companies that have one of the best
safety records of any industry because one company had an accident would you
 have agreed?



If George W. Bush had used a forged document as the basis of the moratorium 
that would render 87000 American workers unemployed would you support him?



If George W. Bush had been the first President to need a teleprompter 
installed to be able to get through a press conference, would you have 
laughed and said this is more proof of how inept he is on his own and is
really controlled by smarter men behind the scenes? 



If George W. Bush had spent hundreds of thousands of dollars to take Laura
Bush to a play in NYC, would you have approved? 



If George W. Bush had reduced your retirement plan's holdings of GM stock by
90% and given the unions a majority stake in GM, would you have approved? 



If George W. Bush had made a joke at the expense of the Special Olympics,
 would you have approved?



If George W. Bush had given Gordon Brown a set of inexpensive and 
incorrectly formatted DVDs, when Gordon Brown had given him a thoughtful and 
historically significant gift, would you have approved? 



If George W. Bush had given the Queen of England an iPod containing videos 
of his speeches, would you have thought this embarrassingly narcissistic and 
tacky?
  


If George W. Bush had bowed to the King of Saudi Arabia, would you have
approved? 
   


If George W. Bush had visited Austria and made reference to the nonexistent
"Austrian language," would you have brushed it off as a minor slip? 
  


If George W. Bush had filled his cabinet and circle of advisers with people
 who cannot seem to keep current in their income taxes, would you have
approved?   


If George W. Bush had stated that there were 57 states in the United States,
would you have said that he is clueless. 



If George W. Bush would have flown all the way to Denmark to make a five
minute speech about how the Olympics would benefit him walking out his front 
door in Texas, would you have thought he was a self important, conceited,
 egotistical jerk? 



If George W. Bush had been so Spanish illiterate as to refer to "Cinco de
Cuatro" in front of the Mexican ambassador when it was the 5th of May (Cinco
de Mayo), and continued to flub it when he tried again, would you have
 winced in embarrassment? 



If George W. Bush had misspelled the word "advice" would you have hammered 
him for it for years like Dan Quayle and potatoes as proof of what a dunce 
he is? 
  


If George W. Bush had burned 9,000 gallons of jet fuel to go plant a single
tree on Earth Day, would you have concluded he's a hypocrite? 



If George W. Bush's administration had Okayed Air Force One flying low over 
millions of people followed by a jet fighter in downtown Manhattan causing 
widespread panic, would you have wondered whether they actually get what 
happened on 9-11? 



If George W. Bush had failed to send relief aid to flood victims throughout
the Midwest with more people killed or made homeless than in  New Orleans,
 would you want it made into a major ongoing political issue  with claims of
racism and incompetence? 
  


If George W. Bush had created the position of 32 Czars who report directly
to him, bypassing the House and Senate on much of what is happening in
America, would you have approved. 
   


If George W. Bush had ordered the firing of the CEO of a major corporation,
even though he had no constitutional authority to do so, would you have
approved? 

So, tell me again, what is it about Obama that makes him so brilliant and 
impressive?  Can't think of anything? Don't worry.  He's done all this in 15
months -- so you'll have two years and nine months to come up with an
 answer.

  Every statement in this email is factual and directly attributable to 
Barrack Hussein Obama.  Every bumble is a matter of record and completely
 verifiable.

[BornToStripe]

No problem, you had to do some research and make some revisions, I understand.    You originally specified that the "government" had grown, not that the "budget" had grown. There is a difference, you know.  Right? And why would you leave out "defense" spending? Is it somehow exempt?

I did not ignore the question, but you may have had some comprehension problems with the answer. In answer to your question re: "lie or is he stupid and uninformed" I now understand that you really don't understand the complexities of how statistics are compiled and used.  I would have to say he is uninformed to the extent that the best numbers the U.S. Government could supply him were wrong and/or incomplete, and that the predictions tendered by the previous administrations were woefully understated.  Whether or not that was willful or just criminally negligent, only history will decide.  Obie was less than 30 days into the job and relying on information provided by the previous administration....in retrospect, that may have been a stupid mistake.  He may have been stupid to assume that the previous administration had any sort of grasp of the extent of the problem. That administration seemed to have a problem with both facts and statistics (see: WMD's, Unfunded Tax Cuts, Deficits, Balanced Budgets, Unfunded Medicare Drug Plans for more information).

You mention that the Democrats had the checkbook for the last two years of the previous administration.  I am curious....during that time, how many spending bills did the previous president veto for fiscal reasons?  For that matter, how many spending bills did he veto in 8 years for strictly fiscal reasons?  For that matter, under what president was PAYGO (the Pay As You Go budget requirement) allowed to expire?  Which president reinstated that rule?

At this point, I personally think it would have been interesting for Obie to have done nothing more than "let the chips fall where they may" upon entering office.  (I had no debt and was ready for the downturn, not happy about it, but ready.) I would have been fine with him cutting government spending, raising taxes and biting the bullet)  Of course, when the economy incurred a 10% or maybe 15% GDP drop, there might have been a very large number of low and middle income people who, upon losing their jobs, their savings and their retirements, might have decided at that point, that some government spending "growth" might be a good thing. The banks might have quit lending all together. The big banks, the car companies and their vendors might have gone fully bankrupt, and most of the members of this forum might have seen 75% (or more) of their business disappear when property managers lost all of their discretionary maintenance budget.

I am looking forward to the November 2010 election, when the Republicans take back the House.  They would take over in January, so I expect they will solve the current economic problems by early next March and we can all go on a spending spree at Big Boyz Toyz.  They have been talking up their economic plan since February 2009, so they have had a lot of time to refine it and it should be simply amazing.  Let's hope the Democrats don't adopt the "No We Can't" plan the Republicans have been using up to now.

In closing, I think you need to take the time to go back and actually personally research on how the country has recovered from previous recessions.  It sounds like you have been getting your info from a Ex-"Morning Zoo" DJ or maybe a dropout from Southeast Missouri State....and I am still curious about your plan to revive the economy.  Pray tell, what is the plan?  I am all a-twitter in anticipation of your no doubt scholarly treatise on the economy.

Just back from fishing in the Gulf....The Oil Abides.

[BornToStripe]

Oh snap, was that supposed to be a burn? Please thank your wife for her concern and curiousity, and she is welcome to stop by and give the equipment both a personal "hands on" inspection and thorough test drive free of charge*.  I guarantee she will find it quite satisfactory.  What happens after that....is your problem.

*I reserve the right to refuse service to the mentally unstable or terminally ugly.

Now let me take a couple more minutes to conflate my reply to your meanderings....

[Calif Striper]

•     Sorry for the delayed response but between a plethora of  work and moving abodes I haven’t had time to joust with you Hamster   Man.
   
  I stated that Government has grown by 25% and that would naturally  include jobs. The government growth of which I speak was the fact that federal non  defense spending per person has risen from $8,000 to $10,000 since January of 09.  My math abilities may be limited that looks like 25% to me. (8,000 x 1.25 =  10,000)You love research, you look it up.
   
  You accuse me of ignoring a direct question while you do it  repeatedly. Obie promised a definite cap on unemployment if congress would only  indebt this nation to the tune a trillion dollars without reading what they  were agreeing to.  I will ask again.  Since Obie did not qualify his promise of an 8% unemployment cap with “I do not  have enough information” did he lie or is he stupid and uninformed? Those are  the choices.
  Personally I don’t think he is stupid, misguided but not  stupid. But when it comes to lying he does have priors.
   
  You said “…but any  person with a reasonable knowledge of economics would realize that after the  spending spree of the Bush years and the subsequent credit bill coming due, and  the expenditures by the current administration, well, the piper needs to be  paid.  Please tell me how to pay off our debt without raising taxes at  some point...
  
  The spending spree of the Bush years was all too real. Of  course the first six years pale in comparison to his last two years when the  Dems had the checkbook. I do not think a person with ”a reasonable knowledge of economics” would spend 800 plus billion  dollars several days after promising virtually no tax increases to 90% of all  Americans unless they were stupid or a liar. Which is it?
   
  Spin that wheel Hamster Man
   
  PS My wife asked about the Hamster reference. I said that I  wasn’t sure but he is proud of it. She replied that maybe he is hung like a  hamster.

[Milt]

Come on! that has to be Bush's fault. Don't make any diff that the Demo's have been in charge of both houses for last four years. Lets give it a try the other way for the next two, worked for Clinton.

[\\\STRIPES///]

TCO said...if we don't approve this 890 billion dollar stimulus, unemployment could go as high as 8%.




I would be happier with 8% unemployment without pisssing off almost a trillion dollars of borrowed money.

[BornToStripe]

Ah, Caliph, you remind me of a politician.  Ask a direct question and the dance begins and the scat flies.

So, again, I'll ask you to point me to SOME respectable source that illustrates where the present administration has increased government jobs by 25%, as you specified (I quote "Obama  in eighteen months has grown the government by 25%. These are jobs that create  nothing and are just part of the growing burden on the American people").  You can even include the census jobs if you wish, altho they were only temps. Do you have a source for this, or was this simply rectal propaganda?   I mean its OK if thats what it was.  I am used to hearing that stuff.  I watch the Glenn Beck Comedy Hour from time to time.

Also, please point me to the taxes that the present administration has increased, other than vice taxes.  Yes, the Bush tax cuts* may be allowed to expire (the Republicans who passed those cuts - by reconciliation - put a ten year limit on them - oops!) but any person with a reasonable knowledge of economics would realize that after the spending spree of the Bush years and the subsequent credit bill coming due, and the expenditures by the current administration, well, the piper needs to be paid.  Please tell me how to pay off our debt without raising taxes at some point....and remember....there is no credit fairy.  Or are you just hoping the tax increases happen after you die?  Regardless, unless the leadership generation of today (that would be us old fellers) takes action to stem the tide of debt, America will just become some second class debtor nation.  The leadership generation of WWII did it, and we should too.  Sure you might have to forgo buying a Mercedes C-Class or a tricked out F-450...sorry about that.  But you know what? My old '98 K2500 gets me everywhere I wanna go.

Re: recession and your plan ('national economic vitality'...what a magical turn of phrase) to turn us around ("it would be  something that has actually worked in the past"), please elaborate.  Please don't give us the Bahner doublespeak ('the way to create jobs.....is to turn the economy around and create jobs') Since you are on about GNP, I note that the Great Depression's GDP drop was about 25%, while our recent recession (let's go with 'Great Recession') only had about a 5% GDP drop.  ( I had to use GDP, as that is how economists measure recessions/depression) From that, you might see there is a bit of difference between a depression, and a recession, About.com notwithstanding.  From my limited reading on the subject, Obama's economic team is following the same path as previous administrations took during previous recessions.  Maybe Caliphian Economics have a better track record than Keynesian's?

Re: The 8% vs 10% discrepancy.  I can't believe you don't understand the complexity of gathering economic numbers and the time it takes.  A president has to rely on BLS numbers as they come available (preliminary numbers are available for the previous month and more exact data is three months old).  He has neither a giant "Unemployment Numbers" clock or a crystal ball.  Don't act like you don't know this stuff.  It lessens my estimation of your intelligence.  I don't mind all the cheap little shots, thats just politics, but I would have thought willful density would be beneath you.

Come on Caliph, back your statements up with something, otherwise it is just Beckian Blather.

*Re: the Bush Tax Cuts.  I have to say thanks to old Bushy. His tax cuts are saving me something north of $500K in taxes this year.  Seems kinda unfair, that a tree hugging homoliberal can take advantage of them cuts dontchathink?  Prolly makes your blood boil. My guess is the government coulda used that money....."I love it when a plan comes together" - Hannibal Smith